Bell and Ross movement question

[aop62]

What movements are in the 02's?

[Bost0109]

Well said and I agree. I would ask B&R for a bit more transparency as to exactly what movements are inside, and brought this up at the most recent NYC dinner event. I think that would be beneficial to both them as a manufacturer and to us as collectors and consumers. People want to know what they're getting and I think lends to the credibility of the brand.

I think we are on the same page. There is a small watch company based in Minneapolis, Minnesota called Padron. The company offers several movements in each model watch with different prices based on quality/name brand appeal (ETA being the most expensive). This type of set up would allow transparency and at the same time could keep costs down for those who are not as particular about the movement. Just a thought.

[sean.scott]

What movements are in the 02's?

The official press release for the 02 Phantom and CF dial said ETA 2892, but I think the other 92 models are Sellita.

[aop62]

well I hope my Phantom has an ETA then

[Gudzyy]

As far as I know only the new 03 ceramic phantom carry the SW300, the old one in PVD should have the ETA

[Gudzyy]

Total mistake I just understood you were talking about 02

[BruceKrig]

And this is where a B&R rep should be weighing in. It is the official forum and in the ask the "expert" section.

I still am not sure what is in my 03 Commando. Not a big deal, just want to know.


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[Bost0109]

And this is where a B&R rep should be weighing in. It is the official forum and in the ask the "expert" section.

I still am not sure what is in my 03 Commando. Not a big deal, just want to know.


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When I originally started this thread I was also hoping for some response from the company based on the "ask the experts" description. I am disappointed that no representatives have joined the discussion.

[sean.scott]

So I may have stumbled over the definitive way to tell! Last night I realized the date quick set of my Military 126 (which definitely has a 2892 base movement) was set by turning the crown in the opposite direction of my high serial number 03-92, which likely has an SW300.

I *think* I may have discovered the way to determine weather you have an ETA2892 or Sellita SW300. Looking at the older manual for the 03-92 is written for the ETA2892, it says the date quick-set is done by turning the crown clockwise. My newer 03-92 manual with the matte finish says "anticlockwise". Since the automatic versions of the BR-S are likely SW300s, I checked the manual for those and it says to turn the crown counter-clockwise as well.

If anyone has both a really low serial number 03-92 and a newer one (SS serial 16000 or higher to be safe or the new ceramics) they might be able to tell definitively.

If this is the case, my newer 03-92 is Sellita and both my 02 Phantom and 02 CF are ETA. Doesn't really matter to me though since they're not display casebacks and they keep good time.

Cheers,
Sean

Update - below is a list of watches I've verified (obviously serial numbers will only matter on the same line of watches)

BR 02-92 Carbon Fiber - serial 5000+ : clockwise
BR 02-92 Phantom #1 - serial 5000+ : clockwise
BR 02-92 Phantom #2 - serial 5000+ : clockwise
BR 03-97 (instructions) : clockwise
BR 03-92 (new instructions) : counter-clockwise
BR 03-92 #1 - serial 16000+ : counter-clockwise
BR 03-92 #2 - serial 16000+ : counter-clockwise
BR 03-92 #3 - serial 17000+ : counter-clockwise
BR 03-92 Heritage (PVD) - serial 12000+ : counter-clockwise
BR 01-92 Heritage - counter-clockwise

They've been using the matte finish manual at least since the 03-92 Commando which came out in 2012, do they could have switched the 03s to Sellita as far back as 2011 or earlier.

[Gudzyy]

I also noticed that Sean, but wanted to check before posting that answer.

I'm off until Sunday ahahah
Will check on Monday but pretty sure the quick date setting turn in 2 opposite way on those 2 movements.

[Kronofred]

Very interesting!!!

[BruceKrig]

Good pick up.


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[Bost0109]

Hmmm. I just checked the BR03-92 that I started the thread about and the quickset for the date is counterclockwise. The serial number is in the 17,000's as listed earlier. This would fit the theory that it is powered by an SW300. If this is correct, I was lied to by customer service at Bell and Ross USA headquarters who verified the movement as an ETA 2892 after contacting the headquarters in Europe (I am that tenacious). Again, this would be an excellent time for a B and R representative to jump in. Anybody have a BR03-92 that actually has a clockwise quickset on the date? If so, how early is the serial number?

[Bost0109]

The plot thickens! I watched several YouTube videos of users showing off 2892 movements (not within a watch). When the crown is in the position to change the date, winding COUNTER CLOCKWISE advances the date. This would be consistent with the Bell and Ross assessment that my watch is ETA. Perhaps the Sellita has a clockwise rotation for date?

[sean.scott]

I think you may be right. My 126 which is has to have the ETA base is counter-clockwise. And after re-reading the original documentation for the 03-92 they say you can "Set the date (clockwise or opposite direction)" but the image shows turning the crown in a counter clockwise position.

B&R didn't remove the date mechanics inside the 01-92, so if anyone with an 01-92 wants to chime in, they can pull their crown out to the first position and see which way they hear a date wheel click when turning the crown.

PS - I'm not crazy, B&Rs documentation did say the 02 CF/Phantom specifically had ETAs...

[aop62]

My quickdate set on my 02 Phantom is clockwise. Serial is 5x99. Hope someone from B&R chimes in soon, as I thought ETA were in all B&R until recently.

[Markd48]

Counter clockwise for my 01-92 heritage

[sean.scott]

It sounds like B&R's press docs for the 02 were a bit off, but it seems like we can almost officially say Sellita is clockwise and ETA is counter clockwise.

[aop62]

Crappy. Any reason why they changed movements?

[Bost0109]

So, I just found a video of the SW200 movement quick change date and it turns in a clockwise direction. Guessing the SW300 does as well but I am still looking for proof. Will keep everyone updated.